Update 10.1

Fabian907

Alamo Analytic
Joined
Jan 29, 2018
Location
Minnesota, USA
Who is on our “side” when it comes to the UL Staff? I kinda feel bad from where things are heading. I don’t blame the staff as a whole but as a team who don’t coordinate well. I don’t like to discuss about their skill/productivity as I am not in their position, but I can see what they say/show/express from their tweets/streams.
I can see that things are about to change drastically since the acquisition from MS and for the future.

This generation of MS games are what I consider the recession.
Halo 4, MCC, 5 were terrible at start but provided great content, especially MCC. 343 is proving themselves as a valid replacement for good ol Bungie. (Bungie left after their contract to build Destiny under Activision. And now Bungie left A. To get their new replacement publisher.)
Gears 4 was the new product the Coalition tried to innovate after Epic Games left. Gears 5 is different from 4 and is great! (Epic games went along their way to do something else. MS got the Coalition. (I don’t know the full story, sorry.))
State of Decay 2 was supposed to be something very different which it is but not the way it was envisioned by many.
Halo: Bungie/343 > 343
Gears: Epic Games Studios > The Coalition
SoD: Undead Labs old boys > Undead Labs new boys.

Considering great things are coming for the future of Microsoft titles, I am worried about State of Decay and Crackdown the most. (Sorry for driving the comment away from the original post.)
 

spacemousetw

Alamo Rookie
Joined
Jan 22, 2018
Meanwhile "they" laugh while Brant frowns. I feel bad for Brant.
Well I am not sure which level Brant played....
But just not my played in the new nightmare level....
Because I played the new nightmare level and there's hordes coming and coming , they just never stop........
I guess no one will think it will fun.

But I have some issue in SOD 1 and I still don't know why, because just when I play and it turn very hard ....since sod 1....
maybe I not lucky ...
 

SomeRandomGuy

Alamo Rookie
Joined
Jan 10, 2018
It hurts a little to (mostly) agree with sentiments like “the game is dead,” but let’s face facts.

There are so many things — big and small — that the Labs could be doing with this game that would contribute (incrementally) to its betterment, that I’m beside myself in bewilderment that none of it is getting done. So much so, that I’m close to slapping on my tinfoil hat and drawing the conclusion that UL’s failure in this regard is (at least in part) out of spite. Just about ALL of the best suggestions (for both additional content and, most crucially, desperately needed game FIXES) have come from the so-called “Old Boys' Club” — aka many of the original Alamo old school players — and they’ve been brazenly ignored. (Hell, they all but openly ridiculed Cejao by laughing at the suggestions he made during one of their streams. Imagine: having a public laugh at the expense of a player who has supported their franchise since before the first game was released in 2013!)

So yeah. My faith in UL has reached near-total erosion. Whenever they make any new announcements re: updates and DLC (as they did this past Monday), it has ceased to be an occasion to rejoice. Rather, it makes me cringe in anticipation at the kinds of wet balls of shit they’re preparing to fling in my direction.

So sad that it’s come to this. So damn sad.
We just have to keep reminding ourselves that there is no more UL, it exists in name only ever since it was sold to microshaft. phildo spencer is in charge now and I would say that is probably a good 80-90% of the reason SoD2 is going the way it is now, the rest being, like @QMJS mentioned, some of the original designers having moved on and the newer ones not knowing how to make changes to existing code or being unable to say what side effects changes may have.

I have absolutely zero doubts that SoD3 will be a totally different setup. It will likely be State of Dead Rising: the MMO. They'll start from scratch and keep a few elements that very loosely tie it in with SoD and SoD2, like managing a group of people with permadeath (I can see microtransaction items being added to revive dead characters and to recruit characters with certain traits) and the resource system but everything else (including skills.....leveling skills is boring! actionactionaction!) will probably be either thrown out or so dumbed down it will be almost unrecognizable, while adding even more ridiculous things than cosplay zombies, meatwagons, and fireworks launchers.
 

Viperho

Rescued Ally
Joined
May 23, 2018
We just have to keep reminding ourselves that there is no more UL, it exists in name only ever since it was sold to microshaft. phildo spencer is in charge now and I would say that is probably a good 80-90% of the reason SoD2 is going the way it is now, the rest being, like @QMJS mentioned, some of the original designers having moved on and the newer ones not knowing how to make changes to existing code or being unable to say what side effects changes may have.

I have absolutely zero doubts that SoD3 will be a totally different setup. It will likely be State of Dead Rising: the MMO. They'll start from scratch and keep a few elements that very loosely tie it in with SoD and SoD2, like managing a group of people with permadeath (I can see microtransaction items being added to revive dead characters and to recruit characters with certain traits) and the resource system but everything else (including skills.....leveling skills is boring! actionactionaction!) will probably be either thrown out or so dumbed down it will be almost unrecognizable, while adding even more ridiculous things than cosplay zombies, meatwagons, and fireworks launchers.

Agree the SoD2 engine is dead, the original programmers probably have all left knowing the game in Unreal form wasn't going to live up to its potential so, we are basically in maintenance mode. I really think SoD3 will never happen due to the failure of SoD2.
 

SomeRandomGuy

Alamo Rookie
Joined
Jan 10, 2018
Combine the two concepts and you can grind your skills the old way...or for a mere $5 you can buy 100 Character Points and level them up super fast. (ala freemium gaming).
I think we can count on this happening, unless there's some government regulations slapped in place before then that do something about microtransactions and lootboxes.

Agree the SoD2 engine is dead, the original programmers probably have all left knowing the game in Unreal form wasn't going to live up to its potential so, we are basically in maintenance mode. I really think SoD3 will never happen due to the failure of SoD2.
Failure? What do you mean? It has MILLIONS OF PLAYERS thanks to the wonder known as gasgamepass.
 

phil

Rescued Ally
Joined
Sep 22, 2018
Location
UK
Agree the SoD2 engine is dead, the original programmers probably have all left knowing the game in Unreal form wasn't going to live up to its potential so, we are basically in maintenance mode. I really think SoD3 will never happen due to the failure of SoD2.
It is about as alive as one of the zombies and with about as much character and movement as a plague heart. Ir is excitement all the way, ooppps I forgot the sacarsm flag, or did I??
 

Mad Dog Kelso

Zed Hunter
Joined
Jan 29, 2018
Location
Florida
Combine the two concepts and you can grind your skills the old way...or for a mere $5 you can buy 100 Character Points and level them up super fast. (ala freemium gaming).
How pathetic is it that we not only can reasonably anticipate this kind of business model; but that we can also concoct plausibly specific scenarios to boot. I GUARANTEE that something akin to “Buy 100 Character Points” will be available as a micro transaction.

The real cringe-inducing part is that they’ll inevitably play it off like these 800-pound gorillas in the room AREN’T micro transactions, when everyone in said room who’s sane clearly knows that they are.

Yeah, it’s gonna be a shitshow.
 

Mad Dog Kelso

Zed Hunter
Joined
Jan 29, 2018
Location
Florida
Ok that mini patch last night to fix the controls freezing in multiplayer did not fix it for singleplayer. My controls froze up after getting an Outpost and I almost lost a character to the blood plague.
Did they actually FIX the multiplayer freeze? I had to give up on jumping into other people’s games last night because my screen froze at least six times in less than 20 minutes.

Haven’t experienced the same problem in solo play, though. At least not yet.
 

CaptainAssassin

Zed Hunter
Joined
Jan 29, 2018
Location
Marietta, GA
I'm gonna rant here, but first a little back-story...

I was watching Kelso's stream yesterday, and he was having issues with his NPCs at home doing a pisspoor job of defending the base (Strip Mall). He tried equipping all of the with .50s which is usually a good strategy but, this time around they weren't really firing that much. One NPCs in particular chose to talk the long walk down from the RT Watchtower to melee the zombies instead. I suggested Kelso try what I like to call the "Red Defense" (everybody has muzzle-braked AKs set to full-auto... Da, comrade). It works fairly well, but I think it may depend on which base you're defending.

I recently moved to the Container Fort, which already has two armed positions at the front door, plus an added watchtower. I get a siege and sit back and watch the Red Defense unleashing a cacophony of AK chaos down from the fortress walls and... hit absolutely nothing. Like, they are just missing... absolutely missing everything. Every single zombies makes it into the base, except for the two plague jugs, which I personally lure into the supposed kill box in the parking lot. Keep in mind, I'm down there with the jugs, bobbing and weaving, with Kalashnikov's Symphony No. 8 blaring overhead... not... a... single... bullet... hits.

What the fuck is wrong with this game? Are the container fort's walls too high for NPC aiming to work properly? Is the calculated range from the top of a watchtower beyond the AI's effective range? Are the bullets despawning before they reach the top of the juggernauts' heads?

What is it? Surely it's something that would be revealed via oh I don't know... QA testing?
 
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e5futter

Rescued Ally
Joined
Mar 9, 2018
Location
Ruins of Danforth
Did they actually FIX the multiplayer freeze? I had to give up on jumping into other people’s games last night because my screen froze at least six times in less than 20 minutes.

Haven’t experienced the same problem in solo play, though. At least not yet.
I've jumped into multiplayer quite a few times trying to get to level five reward for the G18 and Sighted P-07. Haven't lost control of my character at all. However, when I try to quickly establish an Outpost, I lose complete control, can't move, pause, break out of grapples, anything. I have to close and relaunch the game.
 

SomeRandomGuy

Alamo Rookie
Joined
Jan 10, 2018
I'm gonna rant here, but first a little back-story...

I was watching Kelso's stream yesterday, and he was having issues with his NPCs at home doing a pisspoor job of defending the base (Strip Mall). He tried equipping all of the with .50s which is usually a good strategy but, this time around they weren't really firing that much. One NPCs in particular chose to talk the long walk down from the RT Watchtower to melee the zombies instead. I suggested Kelso try what I like to call the "Red Defense" (everybody has muzzle-braked AKs set to full-auto... Da, comrade). It works fairly well, but I think it may depend on which base you're defending.

I recently moved to the Container Fort, which already has two armed positions at the front door, plus an added watchtower. I get a siege and sit back and watch the Red Defense unleashing a cacophony of AK chaos down from the fortress walls and... hit absolutely nothing. Like, they are just missing... absolutely missing everything. Every single zombies makes it into the base, except for the two plague jugs, which I personally lure into the supposed kill box in the parking lot. Keep in mind, I'm down there with the jugs, bobbing and weaving, with Kalashnikov's Symphony No. 8 blaring overhead... not... a... single... bullet... hits.

What the fuck is wrong with this game? Are the container fort's walls too high for NPC aiming to work properly? Is the calculated range from the top of a watchtower beyond the AI's effective range? Are the bullets despawning before they reach the top of the juggernauts' heads?

What is it? Surely it's something that would be revealed via oh I don't know... QA testing?
I've noticed this as well and not just with the container fort. From what I've experienced there is no rhyme or reason, it just occasionally happens that the AI will decide it can't hit a damn thing with guns (aside from grenade launchers because of the AOE) and only the ones who run to melee will do any good.
 

Mad Dog Kelso

Zed Hunter
Joined
Jan 29, 2018
Location
Florida
I've noticed this as well and not just with the container fort. From what I've experienced there is no rhyme or reason, it just occasionally happens that the AI will decide it can't hit a damn thing with guns (aside from grenade launchers because of the AOE) and only the ones who run to melee will do any good.
Oh, but the Hostile Human Enclaves (HHEs) have ZERO problems taking on endless waves of zombie hordes — be they of the normal, special, or Red Menace variety. Hell, even the last man (or woman) standing in these HHEs looks like John Rambo taking on the entire Viet Cong in First Blood Part II. These Hostiles are damn near unstoppable. Practically immortal. The other day, I watched on in mute disbelief as two Plague Jugs and one Feral met their demise at the hands of a single, mortally wounded (but eternally tenacious) Hostile before she finally went down in a cyclone of swipes and bites.

So let’s crunch the math here, shall we. My specially trained community of eight crack-squad bad-asses, all of them wielding Bounty Classic AKs set to "auto," can’t hit a tractor-sized bullseye painted on the back side of a barn; but a small HHE composed of three doofuses camped out in a dilapidated shed can fend off the zombie Legions of Doom for nearly 15 real-time minutes.

Funny how that works, ain’t it.
 
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SomeRandomGuy

Alamo Rookie
Joined
Jan 10, 2018
Oh, but the Hostile Human Enclaves (HHEs) have ZERO problems taking on endless waves of zombie hordes — be they of the normal, special, or Red Menace variety. Hell, even the last man (or woman) standing in these HHEs looks like John Rambo taking on the entire Viet Cong in First Blood Part II. These Hostiles are damn near unstoppable. Practically immortal. The other day, I watched on in mute disbelief as two Plague Jugs and one Feral met their demise at the hands of a single, mortally wounded (but eternally tenacious) Hostile before she finally went down in a cyclone of swipes and bites.

So let’s crunch the math here, shall we. My specially trained community of eight crack-squad bad-asses, all of them wielding Bounty Classic AKs set to "auto," can’t hit a tractor-sized bullseye painted on the back side of a barn; but a small HHE composed of three doofuses camped out in a dilapidated shed can fend off the zombie Legions of Doom for nearly 15 real-time minutes.

Funny how that works, ain’t it.
"Funny" isn't really the word I'd use to describe it. I mean, I get it, they need to make sure the "actionactionaction!" crowd has stuff to do during a siege, if the AI wiped everything out they'd complain that sieges were too easy and we can't have that.

And the hostile enclaves, well, they were too weak before (nevermind that it was totally 100% realistic they die that quickly) so something had to be done to make them better than the standard AI, otherwise the "actionactionaction!" crowd would get bored of killing them. Everything must be a challenge (yes, I'm laughing using that word to describe the utter bullshit of inconsistent AI behavior) else the MILLIONS OF PLAYERS might get bored and find something else to do.
 

Mad Dog Kelso

Zed Hunter
Joined
Jan 29, 2018
Location
Florida
"Funny" isn't really the word I'd use to describe it. I mean, I get it, they need to make sure the "actionactionaction!" crowd has stuff to do during a siege, if the AI wiped everything out they'd complain that sieges were too easy and we can't have that.

And the hostile enclaves, well, they were too weak before (nevermind that it was totally 100% realistic they die that quickly) so something had to be done to make them better than the standard AI, otherwise the "actionactionaction!" crowd would get bored of killing them. Everything must be a challenge (yes, I'm laughing using that word to describe the utter bullshit of inconsistent AI behavior) else the MILLIONS OF PLAYERS might get bored and find something else to do.
Here's the kicker, SomeRandom Guy . . . eight Survivors who are maximally leveled and loaded for bear should have no problem making short work of even the most vicious, fearsome hordes. One thing I positively loved about SoD 1 was that it rewarded you for putting in the extra effort. So, for example, if you tightly grouped your Outposts around a larger home base and expended the resources to mine them, you could effectively create a rather sizable Safe Zone in which you might potentially operate with impunity. Sure, by default you sacrificed having a more spread out system of Outposts, but that was YOUR choice.

There are others, but I won't belabor the point. By now, we're all thoroughly familiar with the bullshit, the charades, and the relentless assfuckery.
 
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Rebel36

Rescued Ally
Joined
Jan 12, 2018
Location
Dayton, Ohio
One thing that struck me while watching the 10.1 update stream was how young these new people with fancy titles were at undead labs. I bet most of them were still in high school when SOD1 came out. The original vision and concept for this franchise and the development of that is different now from what we anticipated. I believe very few people now at Undead Labs even know what that original idea was at this point. The idea of a somewhat realistic (though not entirely so) zombie survival game, centered around the idea of developing a core community of survivors and included base building, scavenging, character development and permadeath as elements. They continually try to implement ideas into the game that detract from what made State of Decay different from the myriad of other zombie games available on the market, instead of those that would enhance it and make it even better. Why? Because as the gentleman who was sitting in the middle of Geoff and Brant explained it, and I can't quote him exactly, but the essence of it was that they were doing what most people wanted. Unfortunately what most players want does not align with the original concept I believe UL articulated for the game. That is why you now see and will continue to see game elements become more goofy and campy and less realistic and survival feeling. It is painful to watch this wonderful game so full of potential for originality devolve into just another ill conceived zombie shooter romp. They did imply they were working on revealing something the community wanted soon. My fervent hope is for some AI improvement or character customization. Perhaps fixing the ridiculous way zeds spawn in the game. My guess though is maybe a new map. Probably not a truly different new map. Possibly a reworking of the Heartland map being added as a new option. Hell, I'd even love that if they would implement it next. We shall see I suppose. As Twain would say, "keep the faith".
 
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Mad Dog Kelso

Zed Hunter
Joined
Jan 29, 2018
Location
Florida
One thing that struck me while watching the 10.1 update stream was how young these new people with fancy titles were at undead labs. I bet most of them were still in high school when SOD1 came out. The original vision and concept for this franchise and the development of that is different now from what we anticipated. I believe very few people now at Undead Labs even know what that original idea was at this point. The idea of a somewhat realistic (though not entirely so) zombie survival game, centered around the idea of developing a core community of survivors and included base building, scavenging, character development and permadeath as elements. They continually try to implement ideas into the game that detract from what made State of Decay different from the myriad of other zombie games available on the market, instead of those that would enhance it and make it even better. Why? Because as the gentleman who was sitting in the middle of Geoff and Brant explained it, and I can't quote him exactly, but the essence of it was that they were doing what most people wanted. Unfortunately what most players want does not align with the original concept I believe UL articulated for the game. That is why you now see and will continue to see game elements become more goofy and campy and less realistic and survival feeling. It is painful to watch this wonderful game so full of potential for originality devolve into just another ill conceived zombie shooter romp. They did imply they were working on revealing something the community wanted soon. My fervent hope is for some AI improvement or character customization. Perhaps fixing the ridiculous way zeds spawn in the game. My guess though is maybe a new map. Probably not a truly different new map. Possibly a reworking of the Heartland map being added as a new option. Hell, I'd even love that if they would implement it next. We shall see I suppose. As Twain would say, "keep the faith".
The age factor is a great insight. And it probably holds more weight than all of us are willing to concede.

But of course, the youngbloods are shaped and nurtured by the culture under whose charge and tutelage they are placed. State of Decay 2's grievous conceptual discrepancies happened because of misguided executive decisions made at the top, not because a group of fresh-faced renegade Mavericks and Goose(s) decided to buzz the Undead Labs tower. These kids' just do as they're instructed. Like good soldiers', they follow orders.

Things might have gone down completely differently. Imagine if events had tended in a more positive, original-concept direction; if Phil Spencer had actually "got it" during his five minutes with the game, and loved the ideas that poured forth from the 2013-2015-era design staff. Well then, the entire SoD 2 development scenario would have unfolded quite differently. Perhaps dramatically so.

And then all these new youngbloods brought on board for SoD 2 may have had a slighty different orientation briefing. For instance, something like this:

"Good morning, friends and colleagues! We'd like to welcome you all to the Labs and express just HOW excited we are to have you with us on this awesome journey into the next addition of our own inspired (and highly successful) Zombie Apocalypse franchise -- State of Decay. Now, in order to establish a meaningful context for the work you'll be doing here, it's crucial that you fully and intimately understand the theme, setting, ambiance, tone, look, and feel of the game we're intent on creating. To that end, each of you will be required to play the original State of Decay (including all its DLC), take extensive notes, and compose a series of questions and ideas based on your experience with it. You will also be required to watch George Romero's 1978 movie, "Dawn of the Dead," as this film, more than any other piece of popular entertainment, best conveys the theme, setting, ambiance, tone, look, and feel that we mentioned a few moments ago, and which we intend to bring (to the utmost of our collective ability) to State of Decay 2. Drink deeply of this movie, friends. Bathe in it. Let its colors and its sounds and its rhythms wash over you. Watch it together. Multiple times. Have it droning in the background as you bring the new game slowly to shambling life. Again, we're excited that you have decided to join our family and take this awesome journey with us. Now . . . let's roll up our sleeves and make State of Decay even better!!"

The kids' might have heard that. And they would have pounced on the opportunity. Like ravenous zeds, eager to prove to themselves and to the vets at UL that they could do it.

But based on the "State of Decay 2" game we got in our own space-time continuum, I shudder to think of the kind of jumbled, disjointed, helter-skelter barrage of dip-shit persiflage the youngblooods were spoon-fed during their orientation meeting.

Aw god, man. It hurts the parts.
 
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