The Little Niggles Thread.

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Niggle — why is it that I can charge a door, knocking down 2-3 zeds on the other side, but a single screamer can stop me from doing it? THEY DON'T HAVE ANY DAMN ARMS!
I don't think I understand, are you saying that Screamers are preventing you from forcing doors open if they're on the other side? If so I've not encountered that, and have in fact knocked down those blighters with that very method.

Edit: of course, this may be a change instituted by 3.0 in which case I'd not have seen it. Also, it's kinda stupid.
 
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I don't think I understand, are you saying that Screamers are preventing you from forcing doors open if they're on the other side? If so I've not encountered that, and have in fact knocked down those blighters with that very method.

Edit: of course, this may be a change instituted by 3.0 in which case I'd not have seen it. Also, it's kinda stupid.
It's not a 3.0 change, I have it happen around 60% of the time since the game was released. The game doesn't recognise the door is an interactable object and you just run against it as if it was a wall, and you also cannot hold the door and shoulder bash it.
 
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It's not a 3.0 change, I have it happen around 60% of the time since the game was released. The game doesn't recognise the door is an interactable object and you just run against it as if it was a wall, and you also cannot hold the door and shoulder bash it.
Huh, that's dumb. Is it a glitch? It has to be a glitch, as I've bashed open doors unto Screamers before. Granted, this has only happened maybe three times in all the hours I've put into the game, but if it were a feature one would think it would be consistent.

....Unless my being able to knock down the freaks was the glitch...

By the Gods, I can't tell if this is a feature or a glitch.
 

QMJS

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Niggle — why is it that I can charge a door, knocking down 2-3 zeds on the other side, but a single screamer can stop me from doing it? THEY DON'T HAVE ANY DAMN ARMS!
I have seen this. Occasionally when they are close enough to a door that they clip through, the door won't respond at all, either to running into it, or opening it manually. It doesn't even have the interactive prompt.

It's not a 3.0 change, I have it happen around 60% of the time since the game was released. The game doesn't recognise the door is an interactable object and you just run against it as if it was a wall, and you also cannot hold the door and shoulder bash it.
Posted as I was typing... exactly.
 

Viperho

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To borrow a phrase, never again. This dumpster-fire of a game is about to be permanently deleted.

Within one minute of booting up the game after this last "patch," the following events happened in rapid order:

"You're not going to like this . . ." -1 Food

"Until we build more storage, we have to expect things like this to happen . . ." -3 Materials

"Don't shoot the messenger . . ." -2 Ammo

Really? Because all my resources are at a little under one-third to one-half the maximum allowable capacity, and you're going to drain them "because there isn't enough room?" But, hey, I guess it's okay, 'cause now I can sort ammo by caliber in the locker.

The best part is, even if you go on Discord to air your concerns, the devs will probably never see them, and the communications/community manager will never relay them because her head's so far up her fourth point of contact that she can't break wind without tickling her tonsils.

I don't mind losing resources for a supposed simulation game like this one, but not forcefully, without any way to improve it. If they want the community to lose resources periodically that is fine, but let there be some user maintenance actvities that we can do like, "clean the dishes" or "sweep the floor" or "double wipe your ass", that will cost influence (or toilet paper) or whatever but as long as we keep that up the losses are minimized. Maybe there is some algo for this, but at least give us the details on how we can improve it. Its like no one sat down and game tested some of the features in this game to MAKE IT FUN....
 
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Rebel36

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Its like no one sat down and game tested some of the features in this game to MAKE IT FUN....
This sums up a lot of my feelings about SOD 2. It has some fun elements but for the most part it is just an annoying grind. Go here, do that, bring us this and be quick about it!! Not fun. Then you get punished with random fate cards every few minutes or an enclave chewing you out for not catering to their every whim and leaving. Not fun. You have no down time to plan anything or do inventory or base management. You are constantly being attacked, even in your home base or outposts. Sieges are constant and take up quite a bit of time. Not fun. Stamina drains really quickly and your weapons don't last worth a darn. Not fun.
I used to complain about Lily but compared to the chatter you get now via the radio wanting you to do a gazillion things all at the same time, immediately, she was mild. The solo/single player experience is really not very fun. In fact, they seem to ignore any suggestion that would make the game a more enjoyable single player experience. Tone down the urgency of some missions and give the player more leeway as to when and how they want to do them. Does noise level need to such a big factor in sieges? I understand more construction and more people make more noise. I can see this as a big problem at a smaller base. But if you move to a larger base wouldn't that negate some of that, at least somewhat? I would still like to see a safe zone around bases (except maybe during times of construction) where you could have a little respite from the constant grind and whining of the enclaves. I guess I could live with the stamina drain as it is, but for goodness sake the weapon durability is terrible. They need to last at least a little bit longer.
Want to make this game really fun? How about giving the player more freedom and options as to how to build or expand their bases. Entire sections of most base sites are under utilized or not used at all. Entire sections of the walls around some bases are not even fortified. Why? Give us those options. The game really needs some kind of story or end goal. Then the missions could have been tailored to mean something and not just be mindless fetch quests.
As it is SOD 2 seems a lot more fun as a co-op experience. It seems like that is its' primary redeeming feature. As a single player experience though it could have been much more fun and a lot less frustrating. We have pointed these things out time and again but unless UL's agrees (and it appears they do not) it is what it is and we can't change anything. Anyway, it's about time for me to stop ranting about the game and move on to other games. You can't keep beating a dead horse. It doesn't help the horse and only makes you more tired and frustrated. I may still play from time to time. I definitely want to try co-op. Just my two cents worth.
 
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This sums up a lot of my feelings about SOD 2. It has some fun elements but for the most part it is just an annoying grind. Go here, do that, bring us this and be quick about it!! Not fun. Then you get punished with random fate cards every few minutes or an enclave chewing you out for not catering to their every whim and leaving. Not fun. You have no down time to plan anything or do inventory or base management. You are constantly being attacked, even in your home base or outposts. Sieges are constant and take up quite a bit of time. Not fun. Stamina drains really quickly and your weapons don't last worth a darn. Not fun.
I used to complain about Lily but compared to the chatter you get now via the radio wanting you to do a gazillion things all at the same time, immediately, she was mild. The solo/single player experience is really not very fun. In fact, they seem to ignore any suggestion that would make the game a more enjoyable single player experience. Tone down the urgency of some missions and give the player more leeway as to when and how they want to do them. Does noise level need to such a big factor in sieges? I understand more construction and more people make more noise. I can see this as a big problem at a smaller base. But if you move to a larger base wouldn't that negate some of that, at least somewhat? I would still like to see a safe zone around bases (except maybe during times of construction) where you could have a little respite from the constant grind and whining of the enclaves. I guess I could live with the stamina drain as it is, but for goodness sake the weapon durability is terrible. They need to last at least a little bit longer.
Want to make this game really fun? How about giving the player more freedom and options as to how to build or expand their bases. Entire sections of most base sites are under utilized or not used at all. Entire sections of the walls around some bases are not even fortified. Why? Give us those options. The game really needs some kind of story or end goal. Then the missions could have been tailored to mean something and not just be mindless fetch quests.
As it is SOD 2 seems a lot more fun as a co-op experience. It seems like that is its' primary redeeming feature. As a single player experience though it could have been much more fun and a lot less frustrating. We have pointed these things out time and again but unless UL's agrees (and it appears they do not) it is what it is and we can't change anything. Anyway, it's about time for me to stop ranting about the game and move on to other games. You can't keep beating a dead horse. It doesn't help the horse and only makes you more tired and frustrated. I may still play from time to time. I definitely want to try co-op. Just my two cents worth.
I agree with this ENTIRE post. Wholeheartedly. And if UL doesn't see (or concede) the self-evident nature of the faults and inconsistencies you've cleary and simply (and honestly) enumerated here, it only exacerbates their (already flagrant) mediocre game-design sensibilities. Because, yeah, veterans who've survived 15 months in the ZA wouldn't know how to zed-proof their base of operations. Because said veteran survivors would actually remain in a place where entire sections of their base's perimeter are collapsed, stroking their genitals and strumming their lyres as Rome burns. Because said veterans would continually light up their smokes near the fuel supply, and engage in half-a-dozen other inept and foolhardy (and needlessly life-threatening) actions over and over and over again.

Yeah, and I slid out of the womb with a warm brandy in my hand and a cigar clenched between my teeth.

Fuck off, UL.
 
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I don't mind losing resources for a supposed simulation game like this one, but not forcefully, without any way to improve it. If they want the community to lose resources periodically that is fine, but let there be some user maintenance actvities that we can do like, "clean the dishes" or "sweep the floor" or "double wipe your ass", that will cost influence (or toilet paper) or whatever but as long as we keep that up the losses are minimized. Maybe there is some algo for this, but at least give us the details on how we can improve it. Its like no one sat down and game tested some of the features in this game to MAKE IT FUN....
I wouldn't mind either . . . except for the fact that there's zero reason to be losing the resources in the first place.

"Some of our ammo was rusty . . ." -2 (or whatever) Ammo. Fun fact: brass doesn't rust. Nor do FMJ rounds. Brass is subject to surface corrosion - which you can remove with a simple household cleaner - but the cartridge will remain perfectly useable. The truth of the matter is, you could go out and buy a box of ammunition tomorrow, never look at it again, and it would still be perfectly able to be fired long after you died of old age. Even a non-jacketed lead bullet won't begin to degrade for years.

"These meds expired . . ." -2 Meds. Another fun fact: aside from meds that require refrigeration and some liquid forms, meds don't go bad. That "expiration date" stamped on your bottle of pills is there because that is the last date at which the manufacturer can guarantee they will be at 100% potency. Know what happens to "expired" pills that get turned in? They get ground up and reformulated, and then get shipped overseas in USAID shipments.

"Some of our building materials got wet . . ." -3 Materials. Oh, gee, that vinyl siding, plywood, cinder blocks and nails we salvaged got rained on, and now we can't use them. Same with those tarps and rolls of canvas. Really? Do I really need to point out the flaw there?

Well, I suppose there's always food. Except . . . nope, that doesn't work, either. Sure, unless you're going out and killing and slaughtering animals, you're not going to be getting any fresh meat. And again, any food that requires refrigeration is going to be a no-go. But canned, dry or dehydrated food? As long as the packaging is intact and undamaged, those will last for years. Hell, back in the '80s when we were out in the field training, they fed us C-rats that were canned in the '60s.

We can't even argue that food would be all that scarce, either. Grocery stores and retailers operate on the "just in time" principle, but where do we think they get it from? There are warehouses - the wholesalers and manufacturers - stuffed with food. Also bear in mind, most of the people are dead, so they're not eating it, seeing as they're busy trying to eat those who aren't dead. There's a certain truth to the old saw about the only things that would survive a nuclear war are cockroaches and Pop-Tarts. It would take the few survivors making a significant effort and several large trucks to make a dent in what would still be available, and if they couldn't figure out how to pick the apples from the trees, well, then they deserve to starve.

Then again, these alleged adults have also somehow managed to progress beyond puberty without having figured out that open flames and petroleum don't play well together, so . . .

At least in the first game, UL offered the excuse that people were using (mostly, but there were still more than a few BS drains) the resources. The survivors in this game, though, are just idiots. You are absolutely correct when you say that there should be methods to offset that idiocy, yet UL never went that far in thinking it through . . . and, it seems, they assumed we wouldn't think it through, either. To wit, I offer the frequency of the FateCards.

Personally, I'm failing to see the point of a "survival" game that deliberately and systematically deprives the player of the means to survive. If I, as the player, figure out a way to make a community sustainable (which is, after all, the whole point of a survival game), I should not be punished for that. Yet the design of the game goes out of its way to do exactly that.
 
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I wouldn't mind either . . . except for the fact that there's zero reason to be losing the resources in the first place.

"Some of our ammo was rusty . . ." -2 (or whatever) Ammo. Fun fact: brass doesn't rust. Nor do FMJ rounds. Brass is subject to surface corrosion - which you can remove with a simple household cleaner - but the cartridge will remain perfectly useable. The truth of the matter is, you could go out and buy a box of ammunition tomorrow, never look at it again, and it would still be perfectly able to be fired long after you died of old age. Even a non-jacketed lead bullet won't begin to degrade for years.

"These meds expired . . ." -2 Meds. Another fun fact: aside from meds that require refrigeration and some liquid forms, meds don't go bad. That "expiration date" stamped on your bottle of pills is there because that is the last date at which the manufacturer can guarantee they will be at 100% potency. Know what happens to "expired" pills that get turned in? They get ground up and reformulated, and then get shipped overseas in USAID shipments.

"Some of our building materials got wet . . ." -3 Materials. Oh, gee, that vinyl siding, plywood, cinder blocks and nails we salvaged got rained on, and now we can't use them. Same with those tarps and rolls of canvas. Really? Do I really need to point out the flaw there?

Well, I suppose there's always food. Except . . . nope, that doesn't work, either. Sure, unless you're going out and killing and slaughtering animals, you're not going to be getting any fresh meat. And again, any food that requires refrigeration is going to be a no-go. But canned, dry or dehydrated food? As long as the packaging is intact and undamaged, those will last for years. Hell, back in the '80s when we were out in the field training, they fed us C-rats that were canned in the '60s.

We can't even argue that food would be all that scarce, either. Grocery stores and retailers operate on the "just in time" principle, but where do we think they get it from? There are warehouses - the wholesalers and manufacturers - stuffed with food. Also bear in mind, most of the people are dead, so they're not eating it, seeing as they're busy trying to eat those who aren't dead. There's a certain truth to the old saw about the only things that would survive a nuclear war are cockroaches and Pop-Tarts. It would take the few survivors making a significant effort and several large trucks to make a dent in what would still be available, and if they couldn't figure out how to pick the apples from the trees, well, then they deserve to starve.

Then again, these alleged adults have also somehow managed to progress beyond puberty without having figured out that open flames and petroleum don't play well together, so . . .

At least in the first game, UL offered the excuse that people were using (mostly, but there were still more than a few BS drains) the resources. The survivors in this game, though, are just idiots. You are absolutely correct when you say that there should be methods to offset that idiocy, yet UL never went that far in thinking it through . . . and, it seems, they assumed we wouldn't think it through, either. To wit, I offer the frequency of the FateCards.

Personally, I'm failing to see the point of a "survival" game that deliberately and systematically deprives the player of the means to survive. If I, as the player, figure out a way to make a community sustainable (which is, after all, the whole point of a survival game), I should not be punished for that. Yet the design of the game goes out of its way to do exactly that.
Damn good post, sir. As much (if not more so) for the information re: ammo and medicinal longevity/durability, as for the comments about SoD 2's lazy and substandard game design choices. I actually learned something. (Note: us Airmen [aka "Chairborne Rangers"] rarely suffered the indignities of MREs; our chow ha--er, I mean our Aerospace Dining Facilities--were never more than 10 strides distance!)
 

QMJS

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There are some interesting articles about the topic. These two are notable. The primary sources aren't linked, but there is enough information to find them if you are interested.
https://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2012/12/26/167819082/dont-fear-that-expired-food
https://www.npr.org/sections/health...ug-expiration-date-may-be-more-myth-than-fact

"Canned food, in particular, can stay safe for a really long time. In 1974, scientists at the National Food Processors Association in Washington, D.C., got their hands on several old cans of food. Janet Dudek, now semi-retired and living in Vienna, Va., was among the scientists who analyzed this old food. Her assignment was a can of corn, vintage 1934, that was found in someone's basement in California. When they opened the can, Dudek says, the contents looked and smelled pretty much like ordinary canned corn. Analysis showed that it had most of the usual complement of nutrients — although there were lower levels of a few, such as vitamin C. Results were similar for century-old canned oysters, tomatoes and red peppers in cans recovered from a sunken steamboat, buried in river silt near Omaha, Neb."

"In 1986, the Air Force, hoping to save on replacement costs, asked the FDA if certain drugs' expiration dates could be extended. In response, the FDA and Defense Department created the Shelf Life Extension Program. Each year, drugs from the stockpiles are selected based on their value and pending expiration, and analyzed in batches to determine whether their end dates could be safely extended. For several decades, the program has found that the actual shelf life of many drugs is well beyond the original expiration dates. A 2006 study of 122 drugs tested by the program showed that two-thirds of the expired medications were stable every time a lot was tested. Each of them had their expiration dates extended, on average, by more than four years, according to research published in the Journal of Pharmaceutical Sciences."
 
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I guess the civil war zeds are here to stay? According to the last UL stream they aren’t removing these zeds, but they will reduce their spawn rate to that of the clown zeds. I guess I wouldn’t mind them in the game if they are that rare so this is hardly a niggle, but I figured I’d share the fact that they aren’t going away.
 
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I guess the civil war zeds are here to stay? According to the last UL stream they aren’t removing these zeds, but they will reduce their spawn rate to that of the clown zeds. I guess I wouldn’t mind them in the game if they are that rare so this is hardly a niggle, but I figured I’d share the fact that they aren’t going away.
Which stream waws that, I didn't notice it in the patch notes stream?

Honestly I've got used to them, but reducing the spawn rate rate is a good thing
 
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