Sieges (even if you are there) and followers should cost ammo

futurehermit

Rescued Ally
Joined
Sep 16, 2018
Sieges should cost ammo (3?), even if you are there. More if you are not there (5?).

If you don't have the ammo, and you are there, then your survivors use the actual bullets in their gun. If there are no bullets in the gun, they use melee only.

If you don't have the ammo, and you are not there, then there should be a decent percentage chance that one or more survivors dies.

Companions should cost ammo in an ongoing manner (e.g., 1/half day). If you don't have the ammo, then the follower uses the actual bullets in their gun. If there are no bullets in the gun, they use melee only.

No more infinite ammo.

Thoughts?
 

SomeRandomGuy

Zed Hunter
Joined
Jan 10, 2018
With the way the AI wastes ammo on continually missing or locking onto a swat zombie to the exclusion of everything else?

Unlimited ammo is the only way to make it work, unfortunately. If they used ammo or actual bullets you'd never have any.
 

futurehermit

Rescued Ally
Joined
Sep 16, 2018
With the way the AI wastes ammo on continually missing or locking onto a swat zombie to the exclusion of everything else?

Unlimited ammo is the only way to make it work, unfortunately. If they used ammo or actual bullets you'd never have any.
I mean it would use the resource ammo initially then only revert to bullets in the gun is that ran out. I agree companions are ammo wasters, but I'm thinking this would more so put needed pressure on the ammo resource vs. gun bullets for the most part
 

Fabian907

Alamo Analytic
Joined
Jan 29, 2018
Location
Minnesota, USA
It's a bit of a complex mechanic in that manner.

World War Z: your AI companions have unlimited ammo but are limited to only their weapons.
Rainbow Six Vegas: Your AI companions have infiltration weapons and guns blazing weapons suited for your command.
Metal Gear Solid V: Your enemies drop their gun with set amounts of ammo. They drop it due to being disarmed or not.
Gears of War Series: Your AI teammates can carry weapons for you and you can swap weapons to potentially increase firepower.(Versus AI can pick up Power Weapons around the map but the ammo is not unlimited. Their Lancers and Gnashers will never run out because they will always die unless it's a difficult AI)
Halo series: You can give marines or spartans your weapon and they will be able to hold it until they die. (If you have one rocket shell left, give it to your ally and kill them. You will get more ammo back!)
Payday 2: You can assign weapons to your crew members without any barriers.

That's just my two cents.
 

SailorWolf

Alamo Rookie
Joined
Jan 13, 2018
Location
Oklahoma
It's fine as it is.....Sieges aren't that big unless you are making a ton of noise so I don't see the point in having to pay 3 ammo even if I'm there. Even paying 3 when I'm not there is to high. lol
 

futurehermit

Rescued Ally
Joined
Sep 16, 2018
It's fine as it is.....Sieges aren't that big unless you are making a ton of noise so I don't see the point in having to pay 3 ammo even if I'm there. Even paying 3 when I'm not there is to high. lol
Thematically, it's to reflect the ammo consumed by your survivors. Mechanically, it's to put pressure on ammo resource and increase scarcity
 

SailorWolf

Alamo Rookie
Joined
Jan 13, 2018
Location
Oklahoma
Thematically, it's to reflect the ammo consumed by your survivors. Mechanically, it's to put pressure on ammo resource and increase scarcity
Nightmare already does that by charging you 5 ammo for like 60 bullets of 7.62. But lets say 1 unit of ammo is a box of 50 rounds...it shouldn't take 150 to 250 rounds to kill 10 to 20 zeds lol. The thing a lot of people overlook is if you want to put pressure on your group, as the player you can do it yourself. Don't loot ammo or meds only use the loose ammo and meds you find, a couple of other good ones is don't make plague cures or repair kits. You can mash those 4 together in a pot, add a dash of no trading with anyone, bring it to a boil and you have a steaming pot of just living off the land ;)
 

futurehermit

Rescued Ally
Joined
Sep 16, 2018
I hear you 😊 It's just that resources are so plentiful I'd like to see something more to compensate. Demand doesn't keep pace with supply even on nightmare and that is just counter intuitive for an apocalyptic survivor game. Demand needs to be higher than supply, at least a bit, to keep the pressure up on scavenging and crafting.
 

DumplingBadger

Alamo Rookie
Joined
Mar 15, 2018
Location
Dorset, UK
The thing a lot of people overlook is if you want to put pressure on your group, as the player you can do it yourself. Don't loot ammo or meds only use the loose ammo and meds you find, a couple of other good ones is don't make plague cures or repair kits. You can mash those 4 together in a pot, add a dash of no trading with anyone, bring it to a boil and you have a steaming pot of just living off the land ;)
I've been doing this for a long time, but it doesn't scratch the itch I have for wanting things to be scarce. I want the game by design to force me to make trade off decisions in what I do.

I want to feel joy at finally finding my first ranged weapon four, five or more in-game days into a playthrough and it being a .22 revolver that I have to share between my characters, every round precious because I'm not being buried under a deluge of items and resources even in Nightmare.

I want to have to choose between building facilities because I cannot find the materials to build both. I want morale to actually be difficult to manage without the right facilities, which ties into having to choose what to build. I want a new recruit to feel like a difficult decision against morale, beds, food etc not just "ohhh shiny fifth skill".
 

SailorWolf

Alamo Rookie
Joined
Jan 13, 2018
Location
Oklahoma
I've been doing this for a long time, but it doesn't scratch the itch I have for wanting things to be scarce. I want the game by design to force me to make trade off decisions in what I do.

I want to feel joy at finally finding my first ranged weapon four, five or more in-game days into a playthrough and it being a .22 revolver that I have to share between my characters, every round precious because I'm not being buried under a deluge of items and resources even in Nightmare.

I want to have to choose between building facilities because I cannot find the materials to build both. I want morale to actually be difficult to manage without the right facilities, which ties into having to choose what to build. I want a new recruit to feel like a difficult decision against morale, beds, food etc not just "ohhh shiny fifth skill".
I think the new 5th difficulty will bring a lot of this in it. But I see both sides of the coin...if you do something across the board like the OP is asking about it ends up pissing some players off while making others happy. The sliders are a nice little trade off in helping people adjust gameplay to a their liking. But I don't see them going all out like PZ has (where you can adjust almost every little thing in the game). Can't wait for the 5th mode to come out to see how many people end up playing ???/???/ green map lol
 

futurehermit

Rescued Ally
Joined
Sep 16, 2018
Yeah looking forward to the new difficulty as well. I totally agree that greater overall customization is the way to go to cater to the range of preferences. In the last webcast UL guy expressed some minor frustration about getting conflicting requests from players and acknowledged the diverse fanbase. Exactly the reason why customization options in the hands of the players is so important.
 
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