More Zeds & Bigger Hordes (impossible)

DJB204

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#1
So according to this livestream, Geoff and Jeff mention how they’ve reached the limitations with this game’s ability to run smoothly. This is why we occasionally have invisible community members at our base. Human characters are very demanding on the game engine, so if you have a community of 6, 7, or 8plus members, they game will remove a couple from the game world so that it can populate the world with zombies. (For every one human they remove, they can add some zombies).

I have a big base with 10 survivors, and the attacks on my base are pretty pathetic lol. I have a trader leader type too, so if I summon traders to my base via Trade Depot prior to an attack, the attacks are even smaller.

I wonder if bigger hordes and more zeds are possible with a smaller community? My current 10man community is on the 52 day, but I have another save with a single survivor. I haven’t touched that save in a while, but I’ll probably jump into it tonight to and see how many zeds I can trigger.

they begin talking about the game’s limitations at 14:28 in this stream when a viewer asks about survivors disappearing.
 

Gmutant

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#3
In other words:

The game is broken and cannot be fixed.

Fucking seriously...

The best thing Undead Labs can do now is disavow State of Decay 2 by calling it a 'Gaiden' or spin off that has NOTHING to do with the first game.

How did they figure that ANY of these compromises would bode well for the franchise? A zombie game with LESS zombies doesn't sell...Reversing course on what made the first game successful is a recipe for disaster!


:mad:
 

Fabian907

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#4
Look at Ark Survival Evolved, you're telling me that you can run 400+ Dinosaurs and 500+ Tamed mapwide and manage 70-100 People, meanwhile maintaing bases with some lag, WHAT THE FAKKKK

They need to consider long load times and put some work into the spawn rate, I don't know how making a game works, but geez, a longer load time won't hurt.
 
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#6
I watched the stream last night and that was one thing that defintely struck me as a "Huh?!" moment. You only have to look at some other UE4 games on the Xbox (Ark and Everspace are good examples) that show there is something...off...with the statement.

I can't figure out a reason that the human/npc characters should be that much more code and processor intensive that they have to remove them from the game to spawn in more zombies in a significant number.

My gut response is they have really inefficent code, probably down to the game being intially develpoed in a different engine and I suspect transfered over en-mass without being properly re-written.
 

chikawowwow

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#7
So according to this livestream, Geoff and Jeff mention how they’ve reached the limitations with this game’s ability to run smoothly. This is why we occasionally have invisible community members at our base. Human characters are very demanding on the game engine, so if you have a community of 6, 7, or 8plus members, they game will remove a couple from the game world so that it can populate the world with zombies. (For every one human they remove, they can add some zombies).
Maybe hair and backpack physics should’ve taken a backseat to making the game good. Those types of things are cool but they’re embellishments to be added on top rather than a reason to cut back on other, better, things.
Not saying I don’t appreciate those things but
Beyond the skeletal mesh extensions what exactly are they doing with human characters that has such a large overhead?
Graphical improvements are cool but for games like this it shouldn’t be a higher priority than gameplay.
 

chikawowwow

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#8
In other words:

The game is broken and cannot be fixed.

Fucking seriously...

The best thing Undead Labs can do now is disavow State of Decay 2 by calling it a 'Gaiden' or spin off that has NOTHING to do with the first game.

How did they figure that ANY of these compromises would bode well for the franchise? A zombie game with LESS zombies doesn't sell...Reversing course on what made the first game successful is a recipe for disaster!


:mad:


I agree with everything and I love it, but less zombies does sell if you don’t tell people before they buy it ;)
 
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borobomb

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#9
In other words:

The game is broken and cannot be fixed.

Fucking seriously...

The best thing Undead Labs can do now is disavow State of Decay 2 by calling it a 'Gaiden' or spin off that has NOTHING to do with the first game.

How did they figure that ANY of these compromises would bode well for the franchise? A zombie game with LESS zombies doesn't sell...Reversing course on what made the first game successful is a recipe for disaster!


:mad:
Sounds like they didn't learn form history and are doomed to repeat it.
 
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#11
Yeah I watch that stream live while I was at work and thought, really LL didn't seem to have trouble spawning zeds to attack my base when I had 15 people defending it
Yeah, seems like they should've stuck with their original game engine instead of moving to UE4 if they've managed to break UE4 so completely that it can't handle the small amount of entities we get in SoD2.
 

QMJS

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#12
they game will remove a couple from the game world so that it can populate the world with zombies
Perhaps not spawning new zombies every 50 feet or so would help, or having safe zones actually work could fix that. But it seems to be saying that they are INTENTIONALLY making survivors disappear, not that it is a bug? I'd be perfectly happy if the survivors at the base were not visible when I am not there, but that should certainly free up enough to let the one that is supposed to be following me show up. In SOD1 I have had 54 survivors at base, with 8 hordes of 11 members each attacking the base. UE4 can't handle 12 survivors and 15 zombies on the same hardware? That is a poor excuse, and goes back to programming again. They simply need to do a better job, not make lame excuses.

Yeah, seems like they should've stuck with their original game engine instead of moving to UE4
SOD1 was using version 3.3.? of Cryengine, can't remember the exact minor version number. Cryengine 5.4 is stable now, with a 5.5 release available as a preview. I think it is likely that they could have updated the code they had and had a much easier time of adding the new stuff. The excuse about multiplayer not working well... unfortunately, that is, again, a programming fail. There is a lot of documentation on how to do that.

Even for the current game, they are using a way outdated version of the engine. Somewhere in all of that extra time they took, they should have updated to a newer version. They are using 4.13, which was released in September 2016, and UE4 is now at 4.20, released this month. I understand that updating mid-stream can cause issues, but when the game you have is not working properly already, it would not hurt to update and see if some of the problems are corrected.
 

chikawowwow

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#13
Yeah I watch that stream live while I was at work and thought, really LL didn't seem to have trouble spawning zeds to attack my base when I had 15 people defending it
I had zombie spawns at x40 without performance problems in the original game.

Yeah, seems like they should've stuck with their original game engine instead of moving to UE4 if they've managed to break UE4 so completely that it can't handle the small amount of entities we get in SoD2.
I think they skipped prototyping completely and just started making the final assets and got to the point where they either redo all those assets or scale back the game.
I remember them saying in one of the post E3 interviews (Xbox daily IIRC) that UE4 isn’t really designed for open world games and they’ve had to do a fair amount of engineering. (What that engineering is I have no idea). The thing is, while that may be correct to an extent, that statement represents a misunderstanding of the tools. Level streaming is perfectly capable of handling open worlds in a performant and controlled way. I’m unsure if in CryEngine all the loading and LODs are automated so they don’t need to do anything besides just place the stuff? The landscape in UE4 uses something like 1/3rd of the memory of a standard static mesh, so assuming CryEngine didn’t have a similar feature that should also be a boost.
 

Just Too

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#15
What about Dead Rising? they had so many zombies on the screen but the one closest to you did the fighting.
Dead rising 3 zombies when grouped up just stand there if they are in the back row while the ones up front attack. Yet there really wasn't lag or anything when playing the game
 
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