Bring back that loving feeling..

chikawowwow

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#61
I've said it before and I'll say it again . . .

UL will come to rue the fateful day they decided that slobbing on the collective Knob of the mainsream was the way to go. SoD 2 is not the type of interactive experience that can sustain momentum, not after the initial novelty of it wears thin . . . and then off. And once the slew of incoming AAA games arrives . . . fuhgeddaboudit!

And then what? Who, then, is left to snatch SoD 2 from the jaws of obscurity, keeping it healthy and warm in the long years leading up to SoD 3? The mainstream? Yeah, okay. (A quantum-regressed 30-year-old Linda Carter will sooner show up at my door in her skimpy Wonder Woman outfit and ask to take my rectal temperature!)

Nope. It'll be us. Only us. (You know, the same froth-mouthed troglodytes from the "Boy's Club" [aka The Loyal Niche] who kept the State of Decay Treehouse trimmed, watered, shellaced, and well-maintenanced for five years . . . sharing ideas, interacting with the UL team, participating in contests, creating neat role-playing scenarios, swapping anecdotes about our unique SoD 1 experiences, other fun stuff.)

Or maybe not.

Maybe UL rammed that razor-studded dildo a little too deep into our loyal asses; maybe it's too late to forget that they chainsawed our Treehouse down while we were in it (and then looked us square in the eyes and said innocently, "What chainsaw? There's no chainsaw here"); maybe it's too late to forget that, upon SoD 2's release, all direct communication (between UL and us) was killed quicker than Josey Wales drew his famous pistols; maybe it's too late to forget about that condescending twit of a "community relations" manager, who couldn't resist (publicly) insulting the "Old-Boy" playerbase, which in reality was (is) a diverse group of fair-minded, intelligent people of both sexes that she knew absolutely NOTHING about; and maybe . . . just maybe . . . it's too late to forget (and possibly even to forgive) that the individual who created and ran UL from the beginning has all but abandoned us -- two times! First, by casually tossing aside many game-play elements that made SoD unique; and second, by failing to personally address even a SINGLE complaint from the people who helped put his "dream" game on the map.

Maybe . . .
 
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#64
Preaching here does nothing though.
I think it's common knowledge (at least among the likes of Brant, Geoff, and Foge) that this forum exists, and that many of the people posting here are from the original Alamo. And thus (subconsciously or otherwise), one wants to believe at least one of them . . . or all of them . . . might be listening. And perhaps even jotting down notes.

Hope springs eternal, after all.
 

osamaclees

Rescued Ally
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#65
We were never going to get a direct continuation due to the looseness of the first game's story and how only Lily could be guaranteed to survive. SoD didn't have the systems in place for saves transferring from one game to another. A framework for a story does exist in SoD2 though and it's actually a serviceable one.

Have the player assume the role of a newly arrived group of characters (no more than three) to an area contested by Red Talon and The Network. The game would start out similar to its current iteration: grab a home base, do some scouting and scavenging, etc. While this is going on the radio plays occasional messages from the two groups indicating to the player their general outlooks, ideologies and goals.

Eventually, both factions will start to contact the player to do missions with them. At first the player will be able to work peaceably with both parties. This allows the player to meet and interact with both of them and get a feel for which side they may prefer. At some point it becomes necessary to side with one group against the other and which group you choose changes end game goals and narratives.

This is all rather basic of course, but hopefully you can see how this could've been easily slotted into the game as it is with little changes.
dunno can be done easily enough. in all the RPG games with multiple choices and multiple endings there is a canonical ending and/or event structure.

take KOTOR and KOTOR2 for example
you could be male or female and you could be good, evil or grey (extremely hard to stay grey). in KOTOR you could defeat the sith and save the republic and jedi or you could become a sith take over the sith and rule as top sith. save bastilla or not, or as sith kill her or join together to rule the galaxy mwhahahaha
in KOTOR2 the good/evil route is destroying or staying in command of the traya academy.

but also as sith you could kill some of your companions (mission in KOTOR, no way! loved my thief/mage jedi + mission + melee canderous = quick deaths by sneak attacks) and in KOTOR2 you could choose to train your companions as jedi/dark jedi if you wish. in KOTOR 2 there were the companion fights too such as mira vs hanhar, remote vs goto and if you have the restored content atton fights "sleeps with vibroblades" rather than you in which if you lose with him he dies.
also from restored in the remote vs goto fight HK47 will turn up with the HK51s

in Kotor2 you even get to set the 2 basic things about revan from 1. male or female? save or destroy republic forces/jedi?

even so there is a canonical story. revan was male, the exile (meetra surik) was female. both revan and meetra were jedi during these storys, fought for the light and won the day for the good guys.
all your companions survive (or good ones atleast cause ofcourse) mira lets hanharr go (i think?) goto is destroyed, your dudes and dudettes become jedi and help to restore the jedi.
etc etc etc

in these games vs SOD there is ofcourse no chance of main character dying (well you can get them killed but thats game over or reload rather than SODs continue on with rest of crew then) but still they could just say ok the canon is................. lets say marcus and maya survive but ed doesnt etc
whatever they decide as to who survives at the end and who doesnt then carries on to SOD2
i like your idea too but yeah all they would need to do is state that canonically xyz survived but abc didnt

edit: thinking about it it would be cool if its the story you said and the 3 survivors you start with are marcus, maya and ed who canonically survive SOD1 and say get separated from all the other survivors sometime between the events at the wall and the start of SOD2
 
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chikawowwow

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#66
I think it's common knowledge (at least among the likes of Brant, Geoff, and Foge) that this forum exists, and that many of the people posting here are from the original Alamo. And thus (subconsciously or otherwise), one wants to believe at least one of them . . . or all of them . . . might be listening. And perhaps even jotting down notes.

Hope springs eternal, after all.
I don't disagree but unless I've misunderstood something even the CEO of Undead Labs isn't in control anymore. With that in mind I can't see what even the 3 of them together could change if it was against the will of their new overlords.
 

SailorWolf

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#67
We were never going to get a direct continuation due to the looseness of the first game's story and how only Lily could be guaranteed to survive. SoD didn't have the systems in place for saves transferring from one game to another. A framework for a story does exist in SoD2 though and it's actually a serviceable one.

Have the player assume the role of a newly arrived group of characters (no more than three) to an area contested by Red Talon and The Network. The game would start out similar to its current iteration: grab a home base, do some scouting and scavenging, etc. While this is going on the radio plays occasional messages from the two groups indicating to the player their general outlooks, ideologies and goals.

Eventually, both factions will start to contact the player to do missions with them. At first the player will be able to work peaceably with both parties. This allows the player to meet and interact with both of them and get a feel for which side they may prefer. At some point it becomes necessary to side with one group against the other and which group you choose changes end game goals and narratives.

This is all rather basic of course, but hopefully you can see how this could've been easily slotted into the game as it is with little changes.
See that the stupid part of the whole deal because the game doesn't even feel like it's aimed at SoD players but more at bringing in new players. But it wouldn't piss me off if my Marcus died in my game but then I get to the Network's base in SoD2 and there he is a live and well.

SoD2 has no real story.....oh yes it's make your own which is bullshit cause all the stories are the same. You start the game then go thru whine, moan, cry then shoot some people in the face..... get more moaning and crying then say fuck it finish your Legacy and it's game over then you repeat the above story.

Had my question answered on the live stream today wasn't the answer I was hoping for but it was the one I figured I would get.
 
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Joined
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#68
It's a shame that most of the changes to the core formula boil down to bad compromises made in favor of appearing to play like a AAA title.

SOD1 was not a "chunky" experience. It didn't have dozens of branches for choices. It didn't have detailed algorithms for dealing with enclaves that used simulated intellect and acted by themselves. This was because of a low memory limit. Of course everything was spread thin.

Now we're in a situation where portions of the ingame environment breach that previous memory limit, and nothing has expanded into giving the player a deeper pocket to play around with. It still feels just as constrained as the first game and the only excuse is that the quality of the game has still breached some kind of hardware capacity after dealing with this issue once already.

There is a state of decay game in here that still fixes a lot of common issues from the first game and builds on it's merits, but only so much that we few that have no-lifed the first game can point them out and not so much that it feels like a new game by any means. The rest of the improvements that we have paid the forty dollars for aren't things that will bring us replay value, let alone justify the fact that every questline still feels like it was compressed for a 2 gigabyte title.

It was acceptable the last time because everyone knew that they were buying into a small arcade title. Now we aren't and I'm just so disappointed.

So yeah, it still has that feeling of a compressed title to me. Whether I accept it as an appropriate standard for releasing a new title with the support and money of a wealthy gaming community is a different question.
 
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#69
See that the stupid part of the whole deal because the game doesn't even feel like it's aimed at SoD players but more at bringing in new players. But it wouldn't piss me off if my Marcus died in my game but then I get to the Network's base in SoD2 and there he is a live and well.

SoD2 has no real story.....oh yes it's make your own which is bullshit cause all the stories are the same. You start the game then go thru whine, moan, cry then shoot some people in the face..... get more moaning and crying then say fuck it finish your Legacy and it's game over then you repeat the above story.

Had my question answered on the live stream today wasn't the answer I was hoping for but it was the one I figured I would get.
What question did you get answered? That the story isn't being expanded upon in future DLC?

Just curious.
 

SailorWolf

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#70
What question did you get answered? That the story isn't being expanded upon in future DLC?

Just curious.
My question was "Will more story be added to the game" and the basic answer was "DLC will bring more to the overall story and lore of the game but as for dealing with our group of survivors....what you see is what you get lol You make your own story by the missions you do or don't do blah blah it's not about what is happening in the world yada yada it's about your community

So when Daybreak comes out we'll get a little info about Red Talon and my guess is there will be a DLC that has something to do with the Network.....that is if they don't ice the game by then and just start throwing themed DLC at us as a cash grab scheme
 

YojimBeau

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Staff member
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#71
You make your own story by the missions you do or don't
"We couldn't come up with a good story, so we decide that was your responsibility".

I get that we did that in Breakdown and totally embraced the idea, but for ULs to fall back on that as the new direction is just abhorrent. How the hell does a dev put the responsibility of writing the story solely in the hands of the player? What the actual shit is this fuck? That's barely even acceptable in a full MMO experience. How the hell did they think this would fly in a solo/4-player game?
 

SailorWolf

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#72
"We couldn't come up with a good story, so we decide that was your responsibility".

I get that we did that in Breakdown and totally embraced the idea, but for ULs to fall back on that as the new direction is just abhorrent. How the hell does a dev put the responsibility of writing the story solely in the hands of the player? What the actual shit is this fuck? That's barely even acceptable in a full MMO experience. How the hell did they think this would fly in a solo/4-player game?
Well from the sound of it the game was going to be Breakdown but with 3 maps because they said the Legacy missions were a late addition to the game. So they figured people loved BD so give them more of the same. Wish is sad cause this game could have been so much more :cry:
 
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#74
"We couldn't come up with a good story, so we decide that was your responsibility".
It's funny because there are some games where I avoid the stories because they're ill-conceived or just plain bad. So that colors my view here but the lack of overall narrative while a negative mark isn't a very large one.

Would I have preferred if the story that's hinted at in the tutorial continued? Yes, of course but I recall many discussions on the old board about SoD's bare bones narrative and how it wasn't used as a point against the game. SoD was mechanics and systems driven at its core. I'd bet UL took those comments to heart and simply doubled down on them, which is unfortunate.

I myself often times said that SoD's lackluster quest lines were of little importance as their primary purpose was to give the player barest of motivations to explore the world. Looking back, I regret that sort of talk as it was never my intention that UL eliminate the game's story completely. However, not once did I think that was something they'd do.
 

chikawowwow

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#75
You make your own story by the missions you do or don't do
My story must be the one about the post apocalyptic delivery service. On call 24/7 except at 6am when we have our routine zombie siege.

How the hell does a dev put the responsibility of writing the story solely in the hands of the player? What the actual shit is this fuck?
IMO they might have had the right idea but failed to execute it. Self written stories are great but the mechanics really need to be there for it to work. Looking at Rimworld as an example there is no dialogue but the mechanics allow for someone to get wounded, leave their partner in favour of the doctor that saved them and then that doctor gets murdered by the ex-partner. All the nuance is in the player's mind and the game doesn't say "oh by the way this story happened."
Consider how different co-op (or even SP with a follower) would be if you could rescue someone before they died. I don't mean stand over them and "Press E to revive" I mean carry them, put them in the car and take them to your infirmary. This would of course require the difficulty to be high enough that people can actually die.
The problem is SOD2s quests are so linear you either win or fail there is no variety in how it plays out and repeat so often so trying to make a story out of it would be like having an audio book just loop 1 chapter.

So they figured people loved BD so give them more of the same.
Yet they managed to remove all the parts which made it continually enjoyable? If I'm not mistaken the premise of BD was to see how long you could survive? SOD2 doesn't even have that, let alone improve on it o_O
I love the prospect of game Devs taking time out to really listen and act on the desires from the community but there always needs to be some oversight or skepticism. "It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." - Aristotle
 
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#76
My story must be the one about the post apocalyptic delivery service. On call 24/7 except at 6am when we have our routine zombie siege.



IMO they might have had the right idea but failed to execute it. Self written stories are great but the mechanics really need to be there for it to work. Looking at Rimworld as an example there is no dialogue but the mechanics allow for someone to get wounded, leave their partner in favour of the doctor that saved them and then that doctor gets murdered by the ex-partner. All the nuance is in the player's mind and the game doesn't say "oh by the way this story happened."
Consider how different co-op (or even SP with a follower) would be if you could rescue someone before they died. I don't mean stand over them and "Press E to revive" I mean carry them, put them in the car and take them to your infirmary. This would of course require the difficulty to be high enough that people can actually die.
The problem is SOD2s quests are so linear you either win or fail there is no variety in how it plays out and repeat so often so trying to make a story out of it would be like having an audio book just loop 1 chapter.



Yet they managed to remove all the parts which made it continually enjoyable? If I'm not mistaken the premise of BD was to see how long you could survive? SOD2 doesn't even have that, let alone improve on it o_O
I love the prospect of game Devs taking time out to really listen and act on the desires from the community but there always needs to be some oversight or skepticism. "It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." - Aristotle

The difficulty ONLY increases when moving maps.

If you just play story... same level of mundane boredom.

Change a map... shit gets interesting fast.

Infection timer went from 4 hours to now only 3 hours and thinking will drop to 2 hours on next map
 

chikawowwow

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#77
The difficulty ONLY increases when moving maps.

If you just play story... same level of mundane boredom.

Change a map... shit gets interesting fast.

Infection timer went from 4 hours to now only 3 hours and thinking will drop to 2 hours on next map
Is this recent? Around launch I went through maps 4 times and had no perceivable increased difficulty.
 

Fabian907

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#79
I was thinking there would be story when I was gonna stay up on the 18th of May. Did I stay up? FUCK NO!!! I cannot believe that I literally fell asleep to a boring ass intro and a horrible "Here you go, go find a base after your truck ran out of gas" How the hell did we end up to a dead end in cascade hills? In drucker county or meagher valley, you were near a few other roads to explore, meanwhile on cascade, you were far off to the side. I personally would like the old map into SoD2, I think it would be okay, but not to an extent to a new story.

We're missing a Breakdown mode like many said, maybe we can manage community in the main menu and have the Breakdown Difficulty enabled, where it checks your day counter and does the math for you.

Diseases and sickness, we need real meds like the first game with the aspirin, tussin, etc. Remember when we had to find items for the facilities? I miss that, what about repairing vehicles with materials, or even park the car and have a repair function added.

It's all about the core features from the first game we all miss and love, It has a perfect formula.
 

SailorWolf

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#80
We're missing a Breakdown mode like many said, maybe we can manage community in the main menu and have the Breakdown Difficulty enabled, where it checks your day counter and does the math for you.
Yet they managed to remove all the parts which made it continually enjoyable? If I'm not mistaken the premise of BD was to see how long you could survive? SOD2 doesn't even have that, let alone improve on it o_O
I touched on some of this in another post but they could fix some of it.

Start with the Legacy of your leader....Give the player the option to continue on after finishing a Legacy. You could stay on that map living the high life until running out of supplies or just move on. Also after completing a Legacy and changing maps, give the player the option to change leaders

Changing maps raises the difficulty a little each time. Hell even throw in a warning box just to let the player know the shit gets deeper on the next map. Also as part of the world being a rougher place to live in...when changing maps the enclave make up changes with it. So you'll go from being able to make lots of friends on the first map to almost everyone hates your guts by say the 6th map.

I have more ideas but if I don't get around and get my ass out the door I'm going to be late for work :eek:
 
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